Episode 13 - Hestakofi

In episode #3 of our second season, we met up with Tim Reinert, the co-founder of Hestakofi. Tim is a trainer veterinary naturopath, who experienced first hand the problems of Icelandic horses suffering from sweet itch, eczema and other skin conditions. The idea of Hestakofi, a name taken from his Grandparents farm, was born; to improve the life quality of horse with skin problems with natural products.

Tim shares with us how to help your horse with sweet itch or after being exported, we talk about sustainability and what problems even horses in Iceland can have.

• https://hestakofi.de/en
• https://hestakofi.de/en/pages/holstic-care-concept
• https://www.instagram.com/hestakofi/?hl=en

Music by Cob.
Follow us on Instagram and Facebook, @the_toelt_tales.

Transcript

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Lionel: 0:00

Hello everybody, and welcome to The Tölt Tales Podcast. Hello, Tim. Hi there. How are you today?

Tim: 0:15

I'm fine.

Lionel: 0:16

We always start the podcast introducing the guests. So for the people who do not know you, what is Tim doing in his life?

Tim: 0:24

Oh, I'm right now, I'm the founder of Hestakofi. And of course, I'm cooking all the products myself with my colleague, Peter, who's also the co-founder of Hestakofi. And before that, I was in the advertising world.

Lionel: 0:43

All right. Okay. And where do you come from?

Tim: 0:46

I'm from originally, I'm from Hamburg.

Lionel: 0:49

So Germany. Yeah. So yeah, you mentioned to us that you were a graphic designer for many years. Yes. So that's why it looks so good. Yeah, yeah.

Tim: 1:00

It's the fun part is always when you do your own brand and you know everything, then you are to create everything yourself. So the silhouette of Hestakofi is the horse of my daughter, actually.

Lionel: 1:12

No. Okay. All right.

Tim: 1:14

It's my interpretation of it, of course.

Lionel: 1:16

Yeah. Yeah. It's stylized in that sense. You mentioned you cooked here and you welcome us into your back garden kind of. Yeah. You actually do cooking.

Tim: 1:29

Yeah. All the products are totally hand made. There's no fact like it's not Chinese. It's not DIY. It's all all own formulas.

Lionel: 1:40

Yes.

Tim: 1:40

Which are top secret for us, of course. And we are cooking everything ourselves.

Lionel: 1:47

Okay. I'm curious. What is a day or a week of your life looks like?

Tim: 1:53

Oh, I had since we are not finding anyone who wants to work anymore. It's really hard to find people to really help.

Lionel: 2:03

You mean like for the cooking or for packing?

Tim: 2:05

It doesn't matter. For packing, cooking, or just filling up the invoices.

Lionel: 2:11

Yeah, okay.

Tim: 2:12

It's crazy. But my day is like very, rather, my week is organized. I cook from Monday to Wednesday.

Lionel: 2:20

All right.

Tim: 2:21

At least three different products, like a day, and then filling it up and put it in the storage. And then from Thursday to Friday, I do finance.

Lionel: 2:36

Okay.

Tim: 2:36

And all the fun part, which is also must be done. And then Instagram. And of course, in all the times in between, I also handle the shipping. So right now, it's like a totally family business. So my wife is always helping, and it's quite a lot.

Lionel: 2:57

So you divide your week basically into the preparation part, and then all the fun administrative, shipping and business, I guess.

Tim: 3:07

Yeah. Otherwise, I would go crazy if I'm not focused on a day.

Lionel: 3:12

Yes. Yeah. A small question. Do you ride, or do you... Well, it seems that your daughter ride, but do you ride yourself? Yeah.

Tim: 3:20

It's very funny because I grew up with Icelandic horses. So I was riding... Actually, directly was put on a horse by my aunt when I was very, very little. And then I got my own horse when I was three. So it was a very, very old Icelandic horse.

Lionel: 3:43

Okay.

Tim: 3:44

It was brought by ship to Germany.

Lionel: 3:48

Okay. From Iceland directly, then?

Tim: 3:50

Yeah, directly. And it was actually there for being slaughtered. And my grandparents saved it. And that was my first... Actually, they had saved four horses. And that's how... Actually, the name Hestakofi comes from my grandparents. That was their stable name.

Lionel: 4:11

So you just started with Icelandic horses?

Tim: 4:14

Yeah.

Lionel: 4:15

You didn't... You know, like, you coming from Germany, maybe it's a cliché, sorry, but you know, like, you would have... Like, the reed school or the... No, you went all in, three year old Icelandic.

Tim: 4:26

Exactly. Because that was kind of my... I always said it was my Bula Bü childhood.

Lionel: 4:34

Okay.

Tim: 4:34

So I was every free moment at my grandparents. And my granddad, he always went out riding with me.

Lionel: 4:42

Okay.

Tim: 4:43

So he had to train me, and the whole family was... Because you have to see, it's like 55 years ago, that everything started with the Icelandic courses. So, and I'm now 53. So I grew up like it was...

Lionel: 4:59

With it, basically.

Tim: 5:00

With all the knowledge and knowing what they need and what's happening. And of course, all of them had a sweet itch. And so it was always a big problem, and they barely had any hair, but that's how... And they didn't have blankets and so on. So everything developed, and everything got hands on.

Lionel: 5:25

So you basically saw the rise of the Icelandic horse in Germany, for instance, or even in the world, I would say, but you were in Germany.

Tim: 5:33

Yeah, kind of, but I stopped when I was 16.

Lionel: 5:38

Okay.

Tim: 5:39

I didn't want to ride anymore because also my granddad died, and then everything, my grandma couldn't handle the whole stable, my parents didn't want to. So everything was sold. And then I was actually too upset about everything. So I quit everything.

Lionel: 5:58

All right.

Tim: 5:59

Then I had a break for 12 years. And due to a bet, I went back. I came back to horses.

Lionel: 6:08

A bet?

Tim: 6:09

Yeah. Okay.

Lionel: 6:10

What was the bet like?

Tim: 6:11

My best friend and I, we went to a hotel, like a Robinson Club, where you're very sportive.

Lionel: 6:19

Okay.

Tim: 6:19

And we said we're going to do every sport, which is on the list. And there was also riding on the list. So and that's what brought me back to horses. Actually, it was of course a different horse, a Hufflinger. But the feeling of being in back, of riding, nature, and it directly was like I never stopped riding. So then when I came back, I was like telling my wife, I have to go back to horses.

Lionel: 6:51

So you bought a horse?

Tim: 6:53

No, actually, then I started to get lessons first.

Lionel: 6:57

Yes, okay.

Tim: 6:57

Again, and see how it felt, like being back on Icelandic horses. But it directly was like meant to be that I really like, I guess, two months later, I bought a fake here, our first real Icelandic horse.

Lionel: 7:20

As opposed to fake Icelandic horse.

Tim: 7:22

No, I mean, he came from Iceland directly. So and everything I didn't want to have, you got it. I got it. Okay. Because this was like love at the first sight. Yes.

Lionel: 7:37

So what you wanted the four gator, you have the five, you wanted the colors, specific color, you got brown.

Tim: 7:45

No, the color was directly clear. I wanted a black one with long mane. So and there he was and super tall.

Lionel: 7:54

Okay.

Tim: 7:54

He's 150.

Lionel: 7:56

Oh, wow.

Tim: 7:57

So super tall. And he looks like more like a non-typical Icelandic.

Lionel: 8:04

Yes.

Tim: 8:05

And he's the best horse we ever could have bought.

Lionel: 8:07

Yes.

Tim: 8:08

Yeah.

Lionel: 8:09

You still have him.

Tim: 8:09

Yeah. That's also the reason why I created Hestakofi. He has, of course, super heavy sweet itch. Yes. And that was the reason why we created it.

Lionel: 8:24

Oh, wow. Okay. Okay. So you ride? You're still riding, I guess?

Tim: 8:29

Yeah. I also ride tournaments. Not so much anymore because I have no time. But I became a double T now. So like the dad who always helps his daughter being at the tournament.

Lionel: 8:42

Yeah. Okay.

Tim: 8:42

Okay. And because after my last year of trying out a tournament, because I have a very crazy horse, he loves to go backwards. Right.

Lionel: 8:57

Okay.

Tim: 8:58

Yeah. When he doesn't want to do what he wants to do, he loves to go backwards. Okay. And that's not funny when you are in a tournament.

Lionel: 9:09

Well, like there is no point for going backwards. There is literally no point.

Tim: 9:14

But what I really, really love is to go to Kronzow Special and do the trail ride.

Lionel: 9:21

Okay.

Tim: 9:22

And it's super much fun. And I always did it with my daughter together. We were always a team.

Lionel: 9:29

Yeah.

Tim: 9:29

And did it the last few, like five years.

Lionel: 9:33

Okay. And this is not something that we have in Sweden. I don't think so.

Tim: 9:38

It's more a fun thing, actually. It's like the last one we did, you had to be a kind of detective. It was really cool.

Lionel: 9:45

Ah, this is cool. Yeah. Okay. That changed from the traditional competition, I guess.

Tim: 9:50

And they always have a theme. Every year they have a different theme, and it's super nice to do. And it's lots of fun. And there my horse goes forward.

Lionel: 9:59

We usually ask, when did you last bought a horse?

Tim: 10:04

Yesterday? No, I'm kidding.

Lionel: 10:06

I wish. I was shocked. I was like, what?

Tim: 10:09

No, I don't know. Like, if people follow me, they know that I found a horse in Iceland, which I'm totally in love with. But I'm not allowed to buy it. So first of all, it's too expensive. And second of all, my wife and my daughter said, we have enough horses because we have, actually, we have four, but one is given to a friend because she can't be ridden anymore. So she kind of has her retirement there. And we have still three horses, three active horses, which has still been ridden.

Lionel: 10:44

And you ride often?

Tim: 10:47

We all ride, the whole family.

Lionel: 10:49

Ah, okay. Your wife as well?

Tim: 10:52

Yeah, my wife rides, my daughter. My wife is only for like having fun, like go outside. She would never go on tournaments.

Lionel: 11:01

Yeah, okay. It's leisure ride. Yeah, absolutely. Do you take lessons?

Tim: 11:06

Yes, of course. Yeah.

Lionel: 11:07

Why of course?

Tim: 11:09

Because you always have to learn. It's like because the thing between you are doing mistakes and the horses maybe misunderstanding. So I always would I would love to have more lessons than I can right now.

Lionel: 11:24

Yes.

Tim: 11:24

But I would like do it on a weekly, but it's more now down to a monthly.

Lionel: 11:30

Okay.

Tim: 11:31

So actually my right now, my daughter rides all of our horses more than we do because she has more time. And it's also she's riding two of the horses for tournament.

Lionel: 11:45

Okay.

Tim: 11:46

So and then I don't want to ride them when she's in training with them because that kind of could mix up the signals or the system that she has with the horses. So but for fun, definitely always.

Lionel: 12:01

Always. Yes. All right. Let's talk about why we're here. I mean, we're here to talk about Icelandic horses. So that is quite started already. So you're the founder and creator of Hestakofi, and you have a partner, you mentioned it before, from seeing your horse having eczema, for instance, to create a company and product. What was the journey here?

Tim: 12:28

First of all, I'm a homothetic of wet. That's what I'm trained also.

Lionel: 12:35

Okay.

Tim: 12:35

So I did it for three years. So now I have a mobile. I go, I still go see horses, which are sick and it's been for 15 years now.

Lionel: 12:48

Oh, wow. Okay.

Tim: 12:49

So and our when our horse got the sweet itch problem, it's funny because he was here for seven years and he didn't have anything.

Lionel: 13:00

Okay.

Tim: 13:00

And all of a sudden, he developed sweet itch.

Lionel: 13:05

All right.

Tim: 13:05

And that was also due to a very rainy summer, again, like kind of how it was now or how it is now. And nothing really helped. So I went to my professor and talked to her because it was doing my trials and lessons. So and I had some ideas and she looked at the ideas and then said, hey, that's a great idea, what you're thinking and you should try it out. And then I talked to my friend Peter about the idea and he's like, yeah, let's do it because he is a biologist.

Lionel: 13:44

Oh, right.

Tim: 13:45

And he can, he looked at my ideas and then he made, he transferred it into formulas.

Lionel: 13:51

Yes, okay.

Tim: 13:52

And then we always tuned the formulas after trying on my horse. Oh, okay. So we saw always the results and kept it very close. And then we came to the idea with the CPD oil.

Lionel: 14:08

Okay.

Tim: 14:09

Because when we started with this, nobody really knew about it. And still I think it's a mystery ingredients because it's still not known what everything it can do and help for. And that's why we decided to go forward with CPD oil.

Lionel: 14:27

Okay.

Tim: 14:27

And it still helps. And now after he's been using Hestakofi for five years, because we were one year in testing.

Lionel: 14:38

Yes.

Tim: 14:38

Now we are turning four years. So he's the first year of only having open ears sometimes because of not wearing a mask.

Lionel: 14:49

Yes. Yeah.

Tim: 14:50

But the rest is super. You will not see that he's an eczema horse because he's super cool. And that also really shows that the products you have to kind of use eczema products a longer time. So skin can be in balance, can come back in balance, which is super important. And we are also, the key idea of everything is that we are coming from how we created all our formulas are more from the skin side of a horse. Okay, so we are working with natural bacteria or with like, of course, we have only natural ingredients, but it's always kind of merged into a the skin system of a horse, also for the pH. And so it's always a good transition.

Lionel: 15:54

Is it why it takes maybe it not takes a lot longer time, but that the time that the skin takes on the product and get used to it? Is it the reason why or?

Tim: 16:05

I always keep saying when you try like put it on first time, you should rather take more instead of less. And then you can really see it that time goes by, you reduce it yourself because then everything is kind of in balance. And this is kind of the problem. Skin always needs time. It always, I keep every time I keep telling people, if your horse is having a skin problem, if it's an allergic reaction or not in balance, you always have to think that it needs at least a year to be back in shape kind of, or under control, because you can't, if somebody says this, you can heal a sweet itch. That's not true, because it's an allergic reaction. You can always keep it under control.

Lionel: 16:56

Yes.

Tim: 16:56

And that's kind of what we are working on, and always when we develop new products, we always go from our needs, or right now we also are listening to, of course, all the users out there. So we are getting, of course, direct feedback of them for our products, but also with new ideas that they come up to us, can't you develop something which goes in this and this direction?

Lionel: 17:24

Oh, right.

Tim: 17:24

Because we always try to come back or like really think into needs of a skin, and like skin needs from a horse so that we can develop something new.

Lionel: 17:36

So your horse basically was the guinea pig for your product?

Tim: 17:41

Yes.

Lionel: 17:41

Yes?

Tim: 17:42

And he still is, kind of.

Lionel: 17:44

He still is, yes.

Tim: 17:45

But now it's kind of getting tougher because all the horses in my surrounding, which are where heavily sweet-edged horses are cured kind of or controlled. Controlled, yes. And so it's always tough to find a new horse.

Lionel: 18:04

A new horse to test or to see if it works or improve. Are you still improving the recipe or are you pretty happy with what you have for the eczema, for instance?

Tim: 18:15

Yes, we are very happy with the product. We are working on a totally new product right now, which is in testing, which will really, again, be totally different to the market. It's going to be a revolution. The first tests are showing very good results, and it's a totally different side, how we came about the idea and everything behind it. It's super clever.

Lionel: 18:48

You mentioned multiple times that it's different from the market. I think when we arrive, you're like, it's different from the market. Do you, what do you mean by this? Like, I assume there's the product part, like the, that you don't use, you use natural element or et cetera, et cetera.

Tim: 19:04

Yeah, of course, everybody, like a lot of companies says they are using natural ingredients. But I think we are the only ones on the market right now who are listed, like who are listing everything which is in the bottle. So all the ingredients which are in the bottle are also listed in the back of the product or they are listed due to like regulation. Exactly. It's called Bauer. They are registered there. So this is all visible and open for everyone, which makes us like there are already a lot of companies who are copying us. Okay. But of course, we are not giving out our formulas, of course. But then you kind of know what kind of ingredients there is. But still, our formulas are still different.

Lionel: 20:03

Did you start it with that mindset from the beginning? Like we need to start like this?

Tim: 20:07

Because every time I got all my nerves, because also being a homopatic for vets, yes, it's always because you have a lot of forces who are allergic against something, and you have to find out. And then you always had these products, and there was nothing listed, maybe three ingredients, but that's it. Because by law, you don't have to put everything on, except if it would be nutrition or food, you have to be really clear about what's in it, but not on the care product. So this was always, for me, in the beginning, I said, we have to be clear, transparent to the world, and also to the horses or animals itself, because we are doing this not to... Of course, we want to earn money, but our main vision is to really help. Right. Because it's kind of a disaster when you have a horse which is super allergic, and it's a running wound, I would say, then you are super helpless and kind of try to have a solution. Yes. And this is why we built up our system, because we also see our brand or all the products are based on a system from the inside and from the outside. This is nothing new, if you are deeply in the whole topic, but it's very precise about, it directly fills in the needs, which is not filled fully, like minerals or supplements, and also the skin side of it.

Lionel: 22:02

Right. And we talk about Swedish eczema, but it's more than just that, because you refer to allergy as a whole. It's not only the eczema that we see from horses, there is more than just that.

Tim: 22:20

Yes, and we are also having a huge problem right now to the climate change. There, you definitely see that you have more and more horses who are allergic. And I also want to say that it's not true that every horse from Iceland is directly getting Swedish. That's not true. It's always based on different things and topics. You always have... I always say you have to... The best idea about when you import a horse from Iceland is that you do a cleansing.

Lionel: 22:53

Right, okay.

Tim: 22:54

So, because... That's the first idea, because the liver cleansing is kind of the main topic. Because that's also where the skin reflects again.

Lionel: 23:05

Okay.

Tim: 23:05

So, if you're cleansing the liver, then you have kind of already put the toxide out. Because a lot of toxides from... Mushrooms or like, it's always a different topic on top, to see what's affecting the horse from Iceland coming to Germany. It's also, or to the world, it's a lot of stress, it's a lot of different things, which is coming from the environment, but also coming from food, coming from...

Lionel: 23:39

Yeah, it's a different type of food, different, yeah, it's an environment for sure.

Tim: 23:43

And if you are always follow me, I keep saying like, please, when your horse comes from Iceland directly, bring it, let it come in the winter or in the spring.

Lionel: 23:56

All right.

Tim: 23:56

Not during the summer, because first of all, it's too warm, the food is far too rich. And this is also in the beginning, you should always see that your horse is kind of no longer than three hours on the grass. This is kind of all learnings which we have for now, luckily, to really have sweetage under control.

Lionel: 24:17

Yes.

Tim: 24:18

There are certain methods which you can choose, and I think we have put it on our website under Holistic Care Concept, and there you can really see which steps are needed to really have sweetage or allergic reaction under control.

Lionel: 24:39

Okay. I mean, I guess the eczema blanket is also a good reflex.

Tim: 24:43

There's this kind of... It's always funny. A lot of people say, oh, that's harming my horse. It's not. It's rather the opposite. It's like when I come with the blanket, my horse always is happy and jumps into it and says, yeah, freedom. Yes.

Lionel: 25:00

I don't have to care about those pesky little stuff, move my tail, be upset. Yeah.

Tim: 25:06

And for them, it's super nice.

Lionel: 25:11

Yes. But there's a lot of things that you can do to, like you say, prevent, maybe it's not preventing, but to reduce the chance of happening.

Tim: 25:22

Actually, you can also, it's kind of a prevent, you can kind of prevent it from being so drastic. Yes. If you really control a few things, you can really have a good step forward with your horse under control and being cared. Of course, it's always different to the horse itself, but as I also said, we have more and more problems with skin, problems with horses. But I really see on my daily jobs, there are more horses allergic against different things.

Lionel: 26:05

Yeah, you mentioned pollen in a lot of other things.

Tim: 26:08

But also material, for example, plastic in riding equipment can also be a problem. So this is like something you really always have to keep in mind. But also, might, might is a huge problem. Right now, this year is kind of the might year. This is crazy because a lot of horses have like really open faces.

Lionel: 26:35

Yes.

Tim: 26:35

Under the eyes and everything. And this is more into like this is a result of might.

Lionel: 26:44

Okay.

Tim: 26:45

Eating the skin, they're like really biting.

Lionel: 26:48

You see them also, you mentioned it, like the ears, for instance. Yeah, but this is more different.

Tim: 26:53

This is more due to the flies.

Lionel: 26:57

Okay.

Tim: 26:57

But it's also a mixture. Like every time, it's kind of, you also can really see it on the horse. Sometimes they start in the spring, and then they're kind of okay. And then they go back on a high season again. So more towards winter. And then they are super allergic against might. So this is kind of where you, of course, you also can have horses which have everything. They have sweetish, they have mites, they have... You call it, you name it. But this also do then to a weak immune system.

Lionel: 27:34

Yes.

Tim: 27:34

So what I'm always about is cleansing the whole body of a horse.

Lionel: 27:40

How would you do that though? Is it this... You go to the vet?

Tim: 27:43

No, no, I do it like there are different... You can... It's kind of a cure. And you do it with herbs basically. And there are different mixtures on the market which you can buy. And then this is really helpful. And I always go into the very natural area instead of having some liquidy. Because liquid is mostly also sugar in it, so it's not good. Because sugar and proteins we are not friends of. And then you just kind of have different ideas about how to cleanse or how to feed your horse.

Lionel: 28:28

When we were looking to prepare a bit the episode, like you mentioned diet as well as something very important.

Tim: 28:39

Yeah. If you have a sweet itch horse, like if we're only talking about sweet itch, then you should really look into diets, especially on what you have feeding your horse extra.

Lionel: 28:50

Okay.

Tim: 28:52

So you always should look into proteins and sugar. So sugar-free proteins, as natural as it gets, it's the best it is, less is better than more. And I'm not a friend of fruit salads for horses.

Lionel: 29:10

You're right.

Tim: 29:11

So a lot of people, I always call this fruit salad makers, and they think it's super good for horses, but it's not. And if you, especially if you bring a horse from Iceland to Germany, they don't know what is an apple, they don't know a carrot. Oops. So this is kind of what we also shouldn't do.

Lionel: 29:34

Okay.

Tim: 29:34

Of course, sometimes you can also argue about, but there are different vitamins in it. Okay. Definitely also need it, but you have to always think when, what... Shit.

Lionel: 29:50

We definitely don't give carrots and apple here. Even banana.

Tim: 29:54

I always think it's, you should always think as a horse. Like what a horse eats or needs, that's kind of what you should give them. And that's kind of what I meant with diet. If you have very structured food, then it's good. And even if you are not putting your horse on like 24-7 on a green grass, then it's also much better. So, this is also a lot of problems which are coming from humanized, because we think it would be good. Yes. But it's not that you're coming from a thought of, this can be good for a horse, or this is what a horse needs. So, but this is...

Lionel: 30:41

I know that it's a bit of a telling our story a bit, but we have a mineral bar now that we stick to. It's like the way they get selen, they get minerals that they are lacking because that's not the same ground, etc. And we try to reduce the craft as much as possible to keep.

Tim: 31:01

Yeah, that's also very important. And a lot of people, like especially horses, very trained, then a lot of people feed muscle build of different supplements. And they are, they don't know that they feed them pig, for example, because the main ingredients is the Essex. Yes, they are made from pigs. Yeah, and the horse would never eat, like they are vegetarians. Yes, so they would never eat pigs or other animals. So you should really always keep this in mind and think, of course, there's a huge market for everything. And I think if you like start, or if you are standing in a horse shop, you're like, oh God, what am I? Supposed to give my horse?

Lionel: 31:56

There's a bit of a, you know, like FOMO, like a fear of missing out, you know? Oh, there is so much stuff that it's most likely that I need to buy something for my horse.

Tim: 32:05

Yeah, and then you always hear these keywords, marketing words, of course, helping here, helping there, la la la. So, but actually you should always look at the backside of every supplements or food, which you can buy, ingredients. And as natural it gets, as better it is, as structured it is, it's more for the digestion of the horse.

Lionel: 32:28

Right. When you say structured, what do you mean? It's like there's...

Tim: 32:32

The food is like hay.

Lionel: 32:36

Right.

Tim: 32:37

So very basic stuff.

Lionel: 32:38

Yes.

Tim: 32:39

So this is something you should always keep in mind.

Lionel: 32:42

Yes. Is it something that you want to go into, for instance, in the Hestakofi, like to go into food or on the diet side? Because at the moment, you don't, right?

Tim: 32:54

No, no. I think this is also... Of course, I have tons of ideas. Yes, I bet. And I always would love to, but also we are in Germany or in Europe. So it's crazy with all the regulation and...

Lionel: 33:08

Oh, right. OK.

Tim: 33:10

And you also have to have so many different things. And I think there are already a lot of people out there, which are creating great stuff. And I rather tell people, go buy this. And I have very good experience here. And I rather partner instead of being another... You never know what's going up in the future. But right now, I'm very focused on skin.

Lionel: 33:38

On skin. That's what you want to nail down.

Tim: 33:42

Yeah, skin and caring. And I want to have people thinking that you shouldn't put chemistry, plastic or silicons or stuff like this onto your horse. That's why we also have care products. The main detangler is also natural. And it does the same... It has the same effect like if you would put plastic on your horse. But it's much, much more nutrition, more suits also the hair, the roots, and it gives also nutrition to the roots. So it also starts regrowing the hair.

Lionel: 34:21

Okay.

Tim: 34:22

Instead of putting something over and closing all the skin types or making it greasy or something.

Lionel: 34:29

It's funny because when you mention a dangerous product, like a product like plastic or et cetera, I didn't thought about the detangler. The thing that popped into my mind is the fly spray that you put where you see, you just take any bottle from any company and you see that it's like scorosive, et cetera, et cetera. You do also fly spray. Did you crack the code of...

Tim: 34:58

Actually, that was one of our toughest products because we have in development, because I said I don't want to have it dangerous. I don't want to have alcohol in it because alcohol is drying and hurting the skin. The skin then, yeah. This is definitely something, so it was really tough because also due to all the regulations we have, because all our products are registered and numbered and...

Lionel: 35:30

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Tim: 35:32

Yeah, a lot of products are not. So, they are just there on the market and are called anti-mosquito spray. But I would say a lot of them are fully with alcohol, which you really can see when you spray it onto the horse.

Lionel: 35:50

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Tim: 35:52

It burns, and it hurts. So, that's something we now, we had also a problem when our first product, when we first did it, when it got too cold, it was crystallizing again. So, then it was, but this is something we never really realized because we are having in the storage here, and I've never, at the stable, I never had the problem because where I keep my stuff, it's warm. So, but then we realized, oops, when it's colder than 10 degrees, it kind of can, it not always did crystallize, but sometimes it did. So, then it was not spraying right. This was a whole disaster, but then we went back to the formula. Now we have a fully reworked formulation, and it really works fantastic. It's one of our best sellers actually.

Lionel: 36:51

Yeah, I bet. I bet. I mean, this is something that, like I said, like when you say like natural product, the polar opposite of it is what we have to put on the horses for the fly. I mean, we went to even like, they sell now those like those plastic thing that you put on the bridle. It's there. That's it. You know, you can put it on your horse.

Tim: 37:17

But also a lot of people just don't think about how much chemistry is in the bottled, in the normal things.

Lionel: 37:24

And they do they tend to smell those ones.

Tim: 37:27

So yeah, also they smell really bad. I don't know if you smelled ours. I mean, this is very, yes, yes. But it definitely helps. And of course, from from the testing, we could say it helps 16 hours. But I'm very like I can tell that everybody who is riding for four hours, your horse is sweating like hell. So definitely you will have a quiet time for at least four hours. But then you can refresh.

Lionel: 37:57

Yes.

Tim: 37:58

Or you can even comb it out if you want to. OK. But also the product we developed is also caring because there is also a broccoli seed.

Lionel: 38:11

Right. Like you mentioned, the detangler also nourishes.

Tim: 38:14

It's always nourishing the skin, the roots. So you always do something good on top.

Lionel: 38:21

And this is what you look for? Or is it just a by-product of, OK, we use natural products? How the construction?

Tim: 38:29

No, the construction is always that you are caring.

Lionel: 38:32

OK.

Tim: 38:32

And like keeping away, for example, because we are also launching now a new product called Anti-Mite.

Lionel: 38:42

Yeah.

Tim: 38:42

It's coming very soon. And this is then we have one against mites and then also against the mosquitoes. So both are also carrying, but actually the mite is even more carrying on top.

Lionel: 38:58

All right. I'm curious because you mentioned a bit your process, you develop with your partner. And do you have researcher as well helping you? Do you look at the research paper or your colleague? No, no, no.

Tim: 39:13

We all do our formulation ourselves. Of course, we are like, like, because we what I learned. So I put everything on the table. So this and this and this. And then Peter looks at how we could develop a formula out of it. Only also not using chemistry, of course, like chemistry. Everything is chemistry, but I would call it not the bad chemistry, because if to be politically correct, everything is chemistry, also the natural, because it's all about formulations.

Lionel: 39:50

But yeah, I mean, yes, there is a chemistry part of it. Do you source your product in Germany locally, or do you source them from Europe?

Tim: 40:00

If you're talking about the ingredients? The ingredients are outsourced only in Europe. Okay.

Lionel: 40:06

Do you pay attention to that?

Tim: 40:08

Yes, also, we are always getting a lot from Poland and France, of course.

Lionel: 40:18

Your bottles come from France, you said.

Tim: 40:21

Because our recycled plastic bottles are also from France. So we all look around what we get best. We have very good partners on where to buy, because that's also on Peter's side. He's very also into always looking to the perfect ingredients from, because we also don't want to have long distances.

Lionel: 40:46

Okay.

Tim: 40:47

So we always try to, we really kind of try to have a footprint after all, like on top of everything. Right.

Lionel: 40:56

Okay. That's why you look for recycled plastic or and so on and so forth, I guess.

Tim: 41:02

Yeah. We also have a little project. We, in Germany, you have fields around a hay, or like if you go to a farmer, they always have flower fields around it.

Lionel: 41:15

Yes. Okay.

Tim: 41:16

And we did one with calendula.

Lionel: 41:19

Okay.

Tim: 41:20

And we took the calendula from there to create our own calendula oil, for example.

Lionel: 41:27

Okay.

Tim: 41:27

Which is, was far too crazy, like work wise, but at least we did also something for the nature.

Lionel: 41:36

For the nature. Yeah.

Tim: 41:38

But work wise and probably economic wise. Yes, it was not there. But this is something I want to keep doing, to always give and take to nature, like this kind of our vision on top.

Lionel: 41:53

Yeah. And keeping close to nature, or not, yeah, I mean, we can feel this is how you speak about your product, etc. At the moment in Hestakofi, how many products do you have?

Tim: 42:06

Right now, we're going on to 14 different products.

Lionel: 42:09

14? And you develop new ones every so often?

Tim: 42:16

This year, we came out with two new products. Okay. Next year, we will come definitely with one key product.

Lionel: 42:24

Okay.

Tim: 42:25

And that's kind of always, because we are, as I said, we always kind to look into the needs, what's needed, what really makes sense to our system, and what's still missing. And I would say, when we have the next year, our new product, when we have finished this one, I think then we are kind of complete.

Lionel: 42:48

Okay. Yeah, okay. You see there is an end goal with, okay, I think we good there, we have the right product for.

Tim: 42:54

Yeah.

Lionel: 42:54

Okay. All right. Okay.

Tim: 42:55

That is kind of what I think, because when I see the needs of the horse, and climate change, allergies, and stuff, so then we are kind of clear on every, then we really have for every need, a new product or a product.

Lionel: 43:13

And where can we find your product?

Tim: 43:15

We sell all of Europe. Okay. Swiss also, Sweden, we've just started, Denmark, of course. Okay. Iceland is getting bigger and bigger. So I think we have every care, like a horse shop in Iceland. It's great to be on the Icelandic market.

Lionel: 43:37

Yes, yeah, I was about to say, like was it not a goal at some point?

Tim: 43:42

No, it was happening all of a sudden, because due to the World Championship two years ago in the Netherlands, a lot of Icelandic people bought the products at my stand.

Lionel: 43:57

Oh, they brought that back.

Tim: 43:58

They brought it back, and then they kept asking me, how can we get it in Iceland? So and then I have a friend in Iceland from Kitka.

Lionel: 44:08

Okay.

Tim: 44:09

And she's the owner. Yeah, she's one of the owners. And then she said, let's try to get it over to Iceland. And now we are selling it through her in Iceland.

Lionel: 44:22

Oh, this is cool. It's funny how it goes, right? I guess you didn't anticipate that, or I don't know.

Tim: 44:28

No, it is things come and go and happen. And that's what I always think is the best. If you have little companies helping each other to grow or to be understood what we are, because to be the opposite side of everything is also, we are fighting against a big market.

Lionel: 44:48

Yes.

Tim: 44:49

A lot of people with a lot of money. And we really did everything ourselves. So we have even not got any money from the bank or anything.

Lionel: 45:00

All right.

Tim: 45:01

We did 100% everything ourselves. So this is kind of, there's like, everything we have has been put into the vision and the idea.

Lionel: 45:11

This is 100% your own thing, in that sense. With the climate change, I guess even Iceland will have the need for those products, I guess.

Tim: 45:22

Yes. We'll see. We're not there yet.

Lionel: 45:26

No.

Tim: 45:26

Luckily.

Lionel: 45:27

Hopefully not, right?

Tim: 45:28

Yeah, hopefully.

Lionel: 45:29

I'm not praying for that. I'm just saying, I guess this is the way it goes. No.

Tim: 45:34

We'll see. I think they still have a very high plus, which is the wind.

Lionel: 45:42

Yes. Ah, right. Yes, true.

Tim: 45:44

And that's kind of also not really nice for the insects.

Lionel: 45:48

No, I don't know.

Tim: 45:48

They definitely have flies and they also have families of this kind of flies, but they are not harming the horses as much. Okay. They have different skin problems in Iceland because I also work very closely with two veterinarians in Iceland. And we thought that the rain eczema is extremely a huge problem in Iceland.

Lionel: 46:16

Yes, okay.

Tim: 46:17

So this meaning also rain, because sometimes it rains in winter.

Lionel: 46:24

And the fur is thicker, I guess.

Tim: 46:26

It's thick, then it's not really cared, because they are living outside, or they are then inside, outside. So this is always a problem. And then they definitely have a huge rain eczema problem. And we have developed also something which really helps on the natural way to get this also in balance.

Lionel: 46:50

Did I read well in your website that you do customize product?

Tim: 46:54

Yes.

Lionel: 46:56

How does it work? Is it customized to the horses or to...?

Tim: 47:00

Customized to the horses, yes. Sometimes we have a lot of clients who are already knowing that they have a very allergic horse.

Lionel: 47:10

Okay.

Tim: 47:11

So if you have a horse which is super allergic against all kinds of natural ingredients, even natural, of course, because there's also a trigger. Yes, absolutely. And then we are cooking this especially for them without any harming products.

Lionel: 47:31

Okay. Is it kind of a challenge for you in that sense, or you're like, okay, how do we go?

Tim: 47:38

Sometimes it is, because I have one client who has a very tough project or a tough horse, because he's super, super allergic against almost everything. And I've been, and this is one of our vision to help every horse in a natural way. So, and then I kept sending her different ideas, and we are very close comment. And then, and this was really helpful also for us to really see what do you still have to let in the formulation to really help. And this is kind of also for us help.

Lionel: 48:25

Yeah, you could go by stripping some stuff to see how it works.

Tim: 48:30

Yeah, because a few of the natural ingredients we have also as a little repellent, not without not calling in repellent, but it's taking flies a bit away, and not fully helping. But it's a different thing.

Lionel: 48:49

And how often do you do that? It's like anybody listening to you today can get you in contact and say, OK, can we?

Tim: 48:59

It always comes by itself. Mostly the people directly contact me, and because I'm also a whole speech on different fares and so on about skin problems. So people start to really know me and know that I'm, but also veterinarians come to us and ask. We also have a lot of clients already from the site, and they're also selling our products. But this is actually our goal, and this is what we always, this is what makes us learn on the one side, but also gives us strength. And for us, it's super important to help.

Lionel: 49:43

Okay. Yes, it's important, but okay. So you end up having more than 14 products, I guess. You have formulas of like, okay, this horse, and this horse.

Tim: 49:54

Yeah, but this, no, no, this is, it's not that difficult.

Lionel: 49:59

No, okay, okay, okay.

Tim: 50:01

It sounds maybe difficult, but it's very, which has always been in it, this is our main key ingredients.

Lionel: 50:11

Yeah.

Tim: 50:11

And then we always just see what we are taking out, not using. And so it's always, it's different.

Lionel: 50:20

Thank you, Tim, for taking the time to talk to us today. And thank you, everyone, for listening. We will come back very soon with a new episode. In the meantime, do not hesitate to share this episode and look for in your local shop to see if there is product from Tim. And before leaving you, we would like to mention that you can follow us as well on Instagram and Facebook, The Tölt Tales, for more news and stories. Thank you so much, Tim, for welcoming us here today.

Tim: 50:49

Thank you so much. Bye!